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 Post subject: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 3:08 pm 
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As I think is widely known, it can often be confusing how many differing and contradictory things one reads & hears pertaining to the field of health and fitness, including nutrition. To the one who is seeking sound information and advice it can even get discouraging.

I have been coming across this sort of thing concerning the topic of casein protein. Not to restate what most reading this already know, but many have felt that taking casein protein before going to bed is a good thing, b/c it is a type of protein that is released gradually (as opposed to whey isolate, for example) -- thought to make sense therefore for those hours when the body is sleeping. However, recently I have been exposed to some who are staunchly against casein. So . . .

Q: Does anyone have a strong point of view about casein protein, and its virtues or lack thereof?

I would be most appreciative for any help and insight. Thank you, and I realize this has probably been discussed before.

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 Post subject: Re: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 12:53 am 

Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:09 pm
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People are staunchly against a kind of protein? Haven't they got anything bigger to worry about?

Have a look at Lyle McDonald's site - there are aa few articles about milk and 'what makes a good protein' that have stuff directly comparing casein vs whey. Summary: they're all good in certain ways and serve their own purposes.

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 Post subject: Re: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 1:46 am 
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1. Experiment on your own and find out if the results are good for you (specific to the individual, goal specific) - as long as you do it in a safe manner.

Personally - I like cottage cheese before bed sometimes and felt great. I've never taken Casein isolated but I could see more issues arising from that than in a food form (like taking a vitamin.. except that casein itself is kind of a food). Humans just mess things up when they go overboard..

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 Post subject: Re: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:13 pm 
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From memory, casein protein has been linked to a few health problems, but what hasn't? If you are into having 100% perfect health and avoiding casein took you closer to your 100% mark then don't have it.

My experience has been very positive, from a body comp and performance standpoint. I notice quite a difference during my morning fasts if I didn't have casein the night before. I think it is also a little more versatile than whey for making different foods.

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 Post subject: Re: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:14 am 

Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2008 9:03 am
Posts: 958
Hop wrote:
As I think is widely known, it can often be confusing how many differing and contradictory things one reads & hears pertaining to the field of health and fitness, including nutrition. To the one who is seeking sound information and advice it can even get discouraging.

I have been coming across this sort of thing concerning the topic of casein protein. Not to restate what most reading this already know, but many have felt that taking casein protein before going to bed is a good thing, b/c it is a type of protein that is released gradually (as opposed to whey isolate, for example) -- thought to make sense therefore for those hours when the body is sleeping. However, recently I have been exposed to some who are staunchly against casein. So . . .

Q: Does anyone have a strong point of view about casein protein, and its virtues or lack thereof?

I would be most appreciative for any help and insight. Thank you, and I realize this has probably been discussed before.


There is NO conclusive evidence that pre-bedtime casein supplements (or any other form of "slow release" protein supplements) improve muscle or strength development, or aid recovery. Despite what supplement companies claim muscle/protein catabolism overnight is negligible.

These types of supplements only "work" if your diet is deficient in protein and/or calories. However this has nothing to do with the type of protein or at what time it's taken, rather simply supplemental protein and energy (and this is where the "success stories" originate from). If you are already eating a decent diet you won't notice any difference.

FYI there is a growing amount of evidence that casein promotes cancer development.


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 Post subject: Re: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 3:23 am 
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A lot of the talk around casein strikes me as brotastic. I'm unconvinced there's solid evidence casein will help you in a way that food or whey wouldn't. In fact, I would challenge you to convince yourself -- at night, take casein for 3 months and record your gains, take whey for 3 months and record your gains, eat a solid snack (w/ protein) for 3 months and record your gains. I'd bet most people won't see any difference, and their gains wax and wain depending mostly on how well their workouts go. And if that's true, you should just stick with food. If you don't feel like doing the experiment, also just stick with food.

I'm not sure we're at the "preponderance of the evidence" point for casein and negative health effects, but *if* food or whey work just as well for YOU, another small reason to wait it out on casein.


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 Post subject: Re: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:46 am 
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You should be fine with casein (millicar) before bed and in the morning, whey isolate after workouts.


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 Post subject: Re: Casein Protein -- Insight Appreciated
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:15 am 
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Joined: Sun Jun 21, 2009 1:27 am
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Salto wrote:
A lot of the talk around casein strikes me as brotastic. I'm unconvinced there's solid evidence casein will help you in a way that food or whey wouldn't. In fact, I would challenge you to convince yourself -- at night, take casein for 3 months and record your gains, take whey for 3 months and record your gains, eat a solid snack (w/ protein) for 3 months and record your gains. I'd bet most people won't see any difference, and their gains wax and wain depending mostly on how well their workouts go. And if that's true, you should just stick with food. If you don't feel like doing the experiment, also just stick with food.

I'm not sure we're at the "preponderance of the evidence" point for casein and negative health effects, but *if* food or whey work just as well for YOU, another small reason to wait it out on casein.


Depends on what you call 'help', if we are talking performance and recovery then it is unlikely, but if you are using it for other purposes (satiety) then it can be of use. I know where you stand on calorie counting but there are those that have success with it and casein is easier to 'manage' than other protein sources, as you don't have much in the way of carbs or fat to deal with.

Does anyone know whether the health negatives that have been linked to casein are related to supplements, whole foods or all sources?

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